From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.5-pre1 (2020-06-20) on ip-172-31-74-118.ec2.internal X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.5-pre1 Path: eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!gandalf.srv.welterde.de!news.jacob-sparre.dk!franka.jacob-sparre.dk!pnx.dk!.POSTED.rrsoftware.com!not-for-mail From: "Randy Brukardt" Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Learning Ada Date: Sat, 17 Oct 2020 17:47:50 -0500 Organization: JSA Research & Innovation Message-ID: References: <1dab8412-0ff6-4081-b973-783167a37e6cn@googlegroups.com> <620a8fb2-758c-4bca-b4d3-f2e49fce3703n@googlegroups.com> <871rj2cy61.fsf@nightsong.com> <211a3c48-447a-4d23-840d-d868da44f740n@googlegroups.com> <87tuvyourl.fsf@samuel> <94513dc0-47da-4603-9ff8-87aa3e24b577n@googlegroups.com> Injection-Date: Sat, 17 Oct 2020 22:47:52 -0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: franka.jacob-sparre.dk; posting-host="rrsoftware.com:24.196.82.226"; logging-data="10047"; mail-complaints-to="news@jacob-sparre.dk" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-RFC2646: Format=Flowed; Original X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.7246 Xref: reader02.eternal-september.org comp.lang.ada:60453 List-Id: wrote in message news:rmfglq$dlh$1@z-news.wcss.wroc.pl... > Dmitry A. Kazakov wrote: >> On 02/10/2020 20:43, gautier...@hotmail.com wrote: >> > On Wednesday, September 16, 2020 at 1:09:57 PM UTC+2, Dmitry A. Kazakov >> > wrote: >> > >> >> I mostly agree with your analysis, except the last part. The problem >> >> is >> >> that the culture of programming and overall education became so low >> >> that >> >> it is no more a race against C++. C++ itself is in defense and losing >> >> against languages and practices so overwhelmingly bad that even C >> >> looks >> >> as a shining beacon. Winter is coming. >> > >> > 20-30 years ago the pointy haired bosses would warmly recommend a >> > buzzword called C++ (or something spelled "tchavasiblosblos" in some >> > places) for A?ti projects, but now they all want a digital >> > transformation strategy with blockchain and machine learning. I'm not >> > sure if the level is really lower (we tend to make the past nicer in >> > our minds). But clearly the notion of programming language was lost on >> > the way :-) ... >> >> Well, the method of ML used in these days goes back to an idea from >> 50's. It was promptly discarded then as too weak to solve elementary >> classification problems. The AI of late 80's was far more diversified, >> advanced and powerful than this mockery, yet it died peacefully, because >> of limitations it had. I don't even know what to think about all this. > > Hmm, I would say that progress from perceptron in 50 to current ANN > is bigger than progress from FORTRAN to Ada. Would you accept > critique of Ada based on experience with FORTRAN? Anyway, > ML researches tried various methods and currently ANN give > best results. Using methods from 80's it would be hard or > impossible to get results obtained by modern methods. > > I would very much prefer more principled apprach than ANN, > but arguing against reality is not productive... The reality is that (non-artificial) intelligence seems to no longer exist, at least where people have power. One can either try to alter that reality, or accept impending doom. Not sure where I stand anymore on this. Randy.