From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Thread: 103376,6511c3dc6e1155c9 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit Path: g2news1.google.com!news1.google.com!news.glorb.com!tdsnet-transit!newspeer.tds.net!cyclone.bc.net!news-in.mts.net!nf1.bellglobal.com!nf2.bellglobal.com!news20.bellglobal.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Warren W. Gay VE3WWG" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7.2) Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: GtkAda Package Hierarchy (was ...vs Windex, Gwindows) References: <87u0tap4rk.fsf@insalien.org> In-Reply-To: <87u0tap4rk.fsf@insalien.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: Date: Tue, 05 Oct 2004 12:38:23 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 198.96.223.163 X-Complaints-To: abuse@sympatico.ca X-Trace: news20.bellglobal.com 1096994202 198.96.223.163 (Tue, 05 Oct 2004 12:36:42 EDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 05 Oct 2004 12:36:42 EDT Organization: Bell Sympatico Xref: g2news1.google.com comp.lang.ada:4726 Date: 2004-10-05T12:38:23-04:00 List-Id: Ludovic Brenta wrote: > "Warren W. Gay VE3WWG" writes: > >>While some of this is unavoidable as the project matures (like some >>of the support moving to this Pango package), I found it rather >>confusing. What is really needed is a comprehensive user guide, with >>full blown examples (not the few that come with the sources). >> >>One area that I found weak in the extreme was how to use GtkAda to >>draw on some sort of a graphics area. Many questions came to mind >>about that (and I have done X Window graphics), but I had to do a >>lot of experimentation and spec grepping to get through that. > > Do you count testgtk in the "few examples"? If memory serves, it does > have graphics examples using GtkCanvas and XPMs. I don't recall now, because it was several weeks ago when I went hunting. Part of the problem (and this is documentation related), is what do you go grepping for? There are a number of example programs there, but how do you look for "something that does drawing" beyond the scribble program? You need to know what you're looking for to begin with (documentation). I think I ended up looking at GDK and GLIB references, but beyond that I don't recall now. Anyway, I don't know if I finally ended up there or not, but I managed to figure it out with a lot of trial and error and looking at specs. Another problem that often occurs in example programs is they tend to highlight some all-singing all dancing feature or group thereof. Simpler examples would probably be more useful, in some cases. I know... we can contribute them ;-) PACKAGE HIERARCHY COMMENTS: One thing about the package hierarchy of GtkAda that "bugs" me, is that the packages seem to subdivided on C terms. For example why do we have a Gtk and GtkAda package? Why are not all widgets and packages under a root GtkAda package? I think the intention of GtkAda was to be a thick binding, so why not make GtkAda the top level package and subdivide things on a thick basis underneath? With the Glib, Gdk, Gtk, GtkAda, Pango top level packages, it just seems a little bit uncoordinated. It pollutes top level name space too. I always ask myself, where is x in the GtkAda namespace? Some font thingies are here, but others are in Pango, and yet others are.. They would make more sense to me as a hierarchy underneath GtkAda, and subdivided by functional category perhaps. As a perfectionist, I guess I yearn for greater namespace purity :) The Gtk.Extra is another example. The fact that these are "extra" widgets, doesn't necessarily imply that they cannot be in a GtkAda.X hiearchy with other "normal" widgets. Why should "extra" widgets be treated differently than others? It just seems to be too much influenced by the fact that they are in a gtkextra subdirectory, which is unimportant to the end developer. If you care about traceability to code, then comments in the specs do that job nicely. Again folks, I am not trying to be critical here of the fine effort that folks have done with GtkAda. I applaud their efforts and as users of GtkAda the rest of us enjoy using the fruits of their labour. It is always easier to be critical than to contribute. Please just accept this as my humble $0.02 worth of opinion. I just hope this post doesn't stir up a hornet's nest, because that is not the intent. ;-) -- Warren W. Gay VE3WWG http://home.cogeco.ca/~ve3wwg