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From: Niklas Holsti <niklas.holsti@tidorum.invalid>
Subject: Re: How to get Ada to ?cross the chasm??
Date: Fri, 11 May 2018 11:43:33 +0300
Date: 2018-05-11T11:43:33+03:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <fll3dmF2i4fU1@mid.individual.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <87d0y3ys2g.fsf@nightsong.com>

On 18-05-11 03:05 , Paul Rubin wrote:

> I've on the other hand seen it claimed that Ada was (my interpretation)
> rescued from oblivion by none other than Richard Stallman, who freaked
> out at the proposal to make GNAT part of the GNU project, because Ada as
> then envisioned couldn't accomodate separate compilation.

Ada has always allowed separate compilation. In the early days of Ada 83 
compilation could be so slow that rebuilding a whole, large program 
could take a week. Separate compilation was essential. Some Ada 
environments (Rational) almost insisted on separate compilation of each 
subprogram, let alone each package.

The issue with Stallman, GNAT and GNU was on the practicalities of 
adapting the GCC compilation model to Ada in a way that also satisfies 
the Ada rules on _when_ an Ada module must be recompiled.

> Jean Ichbiah had instead decided there had to be a library of compiled
> packages that the compiler had to access while compiling,

IAUI this was a DoD requirement for Ada. The central point of the 
library was that separate compilation should not let one circumvent the 
language rules (dependencies, consistency, etc.), whether by mistake or 
on purpose.

> which made the order in which separate modules were compiled critical.

The natural order: if module A depends on the (interface of) module B, 
then the (interface of) module B must be compiled before module A. In 
other words, if (the interface of) module B changes, then module A must 
be recompiled before the program is linked.

The Ada library broke the GCC principle that every source-code file (.c) 
is compiled into an object file (.o), and so broke the principles on 
which "make" operates (by incorporating the dependency-tracking into the 
library).

The library-based Ada compilers were certainly practical for Ada 
programming, and most of them had a tool to suggest a compilation order, 
similar to "make". But inter-language "make" was complicated.

> After discussions with
> Stallman, Bob Dewar then came up with a way to allow Ada packages to be
> compiled separately from each other,

Separate compilation was possible before; what was invented was a way to 
avoid implementing the Ada library concretely as some kind of database 
of the compiled modules.

The idea in the GNAT "source-based library" is to view the set of Ada 
_source code_ files as the "Ada library", and implement "with" in the 
same way as "#include": the withed declarations are (re-)compiled on the 
fly when the withing unit is compiled. The penalty for such 
recompilation is smaller today, with faster machines and compilers.

Then every source-code module (.ads and .adb pair, plus possible 
separate subunits) is compiled into its own object file (.o). The 
compiler further tracks dependencies in the "Ada library information" 
files (.ali) files, which (in a sense) correspond to the dependency 
files that can be automatically generated from a C compilation and 
translated into "make" dependencies.

 > and everyone uses that scheme today.

Some do, some don't.

Certainly the source-based library makes compiling Ada programs more 
similar to the process for other languages and so helps novices start 
with Ada.

It's interesting and somehow paradoxical that many C/C++ programming 
systems implement "precompiled headers" to avoid the recompilation of 
the header files for each "#include". A C/C++ system with precompiled 
headers is implementing a "C library" similar to the original "Ada 
library", although better hidden from the users.

Moreover, I recall that in some C++ compilers it was important to 
compile templates in a particular order, but perhaps this problem has 
been solved now, with the better standardisation of templates.

-- 
Niklas Holsti
Tidorum Ltd
niklas holsti tidorum fi
       .      @       .


  parent reply	other threads:[~2018-05-11  8:43 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 510+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-04-15 21:48 How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Dan'l Miller
2018-04-16  3:02 ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-25 22:48   ` How to get Ada to "cross the chasm"? Randy Brukardt
2018-04-26  8:29     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-16  5:35 ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Paul Rubin
2018-04-16 14:07   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-16 15:23     ` Mehdi Saada
2018-04-16 18:07       ` How to get Ada to ?cross the chasm?? Simon Clubley
2018-04-16 18:13         ` Luke A. Guest
2018-04-16 19:04           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-16 19:53             ` Luke A. Guest
2018-07-10  2:41         ` toanpx.hut
2018-07-10  4:32           ` Lucretia
2018-07-10  4:55             ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-07-10 12:06               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-10 12:36                 ` Lucretia
2018-07-10 14:26                   ` Simon Wright
2018-07-10 15:37                     ` Alejandro R. Mosteo
2018-07-10 13:23                 ` Björn Lundin
2018-07-10 14:19                   ` Simon Wright
2018-07-10 14:57                     ` Björn Lundin
2018-07-10 15:31                       ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-07-10 18:12                         ` Björn Lundin
2018-07-10 18:22                           ` Lucretia
2018-07-10 18:26                 ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-10 19:16                   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-10 14:23               ` Simon Wright
2018-04-17 15:53   ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Dan'l Miller
2018-04-17 18:27     ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-19  5:57     ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-19 14:48       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-20 10:27         ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-20 13:25           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-20 13:44             ` Shark8
2018-04-20 17:41               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-20 21:16                 ` Shark8
2018-04-20 21:25                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-20 22:49                     ` Shark8
2018-04-21  0:10                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-21  1:50                         ` Shark8
2018-04-21  2:10                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-21  5:38                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-25 23:02                         ` How to get Ada to "cross the chasm"? Randy Brukardt
2018-04-26  7:45                           ` Simon Wright
2018-04-26  7:57                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-26  8:35                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-26 17:38                             ` Mehdi Saada
2018-04-26 19:38                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-27  9:23                                 ` G. B.
2018-04-27  9:52                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-26 23:19                               ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-27  7:40                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-30 19:40                                 ` Norman Worth
2018-04-27  1:10                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 18:23                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-21 23:01               ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Brian Drummond
2018-04-21 23:50                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-20 19:34             ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-20 21:16               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-20 21:24                 ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-21 19:27               ` Simon Wright
2018-04-21 21:28                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-21 21:48                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-21 22:11                   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-26  3:48                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-25 22:46           ` How to get Ada to "cross the chasm"? Randy Brukardt
2018-04-25 22:56     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-18 13:29   ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Jere
2018-04-18 17:02     ` Lucretia
2018-04-18 17:59       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-19  2:00         ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-04 13:30       ` Jere
2018-05-04 15:57         ` Simon Wright
2018-05-04 19:07         ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-04 19:25           ` Jere
2018-05-05  4:01           ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-05  8:06             ` Simon Wright
2018-05-05 20:02               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-05 20:22                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-05 23:06                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-05 23:32                     ` G.B.
2018-05-05 23:37                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-06  1:15                         ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-06  7:08                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-06  8:02                           ` Simon Wright
2018-05-06  8:38                             ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-06 10:16                               ` Simon Wright
2018-05-06 15:18                                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-06 17:40                                   ` Simon Wright
2018-05-06 16:58                     ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-05-08  6:32                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08  8:28                         ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-05-09  6:42                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09 11:18                             ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-05-07 23:44                     ` How to get Ada to 'cross the chasm'? Randy Brukardt
2018-07-14  9:27       ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? jm.tarrasa
2018-07-14 10:07         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-14 14:28           ` Shark8
2018-07-14 15:04             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-14 15:48             ` Niklas Holsti
2018-07-25  5:16               ` Brad Moore
2018-07-15 14:32             ` AdaMagica
2018-07-15 15:16               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-14 14:49         ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-04-19  9:31     ` Marius Amado-Alves
2018-04-18  1:48 ` Mehdi Saada
2018-04-18  9:54   ` Simon Wright
2018-04-18 12:47     ` How to get Ada to ?cross the chasm?? Simon Clubley
2018-04-18 14:12       ` Simon Wright
2018-04-18 19:57       ` invalid
2018-04-18 12:44   ` Simon Clubley
2018-04-18 13:53     ` J-P. Rosen
2018-04-18 18:19       ` Simon Clubley
2018-04-18 18:54         ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-18 14:31     ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-18 17:08       ` Lucretia
2018-04-18 18:42         ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-18 21:03         ` Niklas Holsti
2018-04-19  4:01           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-19 14:28             ` Shark8
2018-04-19 14:57               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-19 15:25               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-20 16:32             ` gautier_niouzes
2018-04-20 17:45               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-22 20:14                 ` gautier.de.montmollin
2018-04-22 20:34                 ` gautier_niouzes
2018-04-25 23:31               ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-25 23:27             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-19 16:02           ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-19  6:47         ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-18 14:36     ` Simon Wright
2018-04-18 15:56       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-18 17:15         ` Lucretia
2018-04-18 17:36       ` Simon Clubley
2018-04-18 20:02         ` invalid
2018-04-25 23:35         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-18 16:45     ` Lucretia
2018-04-18 17:30       ` Simon Wright
2018-04-18 17:49         ` Simon Clubley
2018-04-18 17:11     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-18 20:00     ` invalid
2018-04-18 20:46       ` Simon Wright
2018-04-22 17:48         ` invalid
2018-04-22 20:15           ` Simon Wright
2018-04-19 15:12     ` Olivier Henley
2018-04-20  8:16     ` briot.emmanuel
2018-04-20  9:42       ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-04-20 13:32       ` Lucretia
2018-04-22 17:52       ` invalid
2018-04-25 23:41         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-26  1:04           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-26 23:27             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-26  1:45           ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-26 23:01             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-27  0:53               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-27 21:20                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-28 17:25                 ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-29  0:39                   ` patrick
2018-04-29  5:26                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29  7:15                     ` Simon Wright
2018-04-29  7:54                     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-29  8:26                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29  7:57                     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-29  8:21                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-29 11:33                       ` patrick
2018-04-29 12:31                         ` Mehdi Saada
2018-04-29 14:34                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 14:42                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-29 14:59                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 15:16                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-29 14:45                             ` patrick
2018-05-01  2:45                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-29 14:57                         ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-30 13:06                       ` Simon Clubley
2018-04-30 16:56                         ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-30 17:18                           ` Simon Clubley
2018-04-30 17:44                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-30 20:53                             ` Simon Wright
2018-04-29  8:39                     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-29 10:50                       ` patrick
2018-04-29 14:52                         ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-29 15:09                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 15:14                           ` patrick
2018-04-30  9:35                           ` Björn Lundin
2018-04-30 15:15                             ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-05-11 20:19                         ` Warren
2018-05-11 20:44                           ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-12  7:38                           ` G.B.
2018-05-15  7:19                           ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-05-15  7:24                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-15  7:44                               ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-29 14:15                     ` Lucretia
2018-04-29  5:22                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29  6:29                     ` gautier_niouzes
2018-04-29  6:44                     ` gautier_niouzes
2018-04-29  7:01                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29  7:21                         ` Simon Wright
2018-04-29  7:48                         ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-04-29 14:58                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-01  3:08                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-01  4:26                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-01  6:43                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-01  7:09                                   ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-01 22:32                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-02  8:46                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-02 14:23                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-02 14:36                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-01  8:17                                 ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-01  9:02                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-01 11:29                                     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-01 15:45                                       ` patrick
2018-05-01 16:48                                         ` Lucretia
2018-05-01 17:07                                         ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-01 17:27                                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-02  0:23                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-01 22:37                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-02  0:05                                           ` David Trudgett
2018-05-01 17:34                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-01 18:30                                         ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-02  0:02                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-02 16:51                                   ` G.B.
2018-05-01  2:59                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-01  3:45                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-01  7:21                             ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-02  0:46                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-02 21:27                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-02 22:28                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-03  0:07                                     ` Mehdi Saada
2018-05-03  0:25                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-03 23:14                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-04  0:07                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-04 23:29                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-05  4:07                                           ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-05  9:50                                             ` Ben Bacarisse
2018-05-05 23:35                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-06  8:34                                             ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-06  9:53                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-06 15:32                                                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-06 17:40                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-06 19:27                                                     ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-06 21:02                                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-07  1:31                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-07  7:25                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-07 17:49                                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-07 19:05                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-07 20:29                                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-07 23:54                                                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-08  7:34                                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-09  5:02                                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09  6:41                                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-09  6:49                                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09  8:25                                                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-09 21:33                                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10  8:07                                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-10 22:27                                                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-11  1:07                                                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11 10:04                                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-11 10:57                                                                                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11 12:06                                                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-11 21:29                                                                               ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-10 21:58                                                                           ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-10 22:52                                                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11  7:15                                                                               ` Simon Wright
2018-05-11  7:21                                                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11 20:46                                                                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-11 12:46                                                                               ` Lucretia
2018-05-14 10:56                                                                                 ` Marius Amado-Alves
2018-05-08 22:26                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-09  1:20                                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09 20:03                                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-09 22:03                                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10 20:47                                                                           ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-10 23:15                                                                             ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-11  7:51                                                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11  8:10                                                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11  9:16                                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11 16:45                                                                               ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-11 19:22                                                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11 22:39                                                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-12  9:29                                                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-12 10:57                                                                                 ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-12 15:51                                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-12 16:08                                                                                     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-12 17:10                                                                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-14 22:21                                                                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-15 17:34                                                                                     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-15 21:32                                                                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-16 16:57                                                                                         ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-16 18:07                                                                                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-16 18:19                                                                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-15 18:44                                                                                     ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-15 20:41                                                                                     ` wilson
2018-05-12 15:45                                                                                 ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-12 19:04                                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-12 19:59                                                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-13 13:19                                                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-13 17:03                                                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-14  0:36                                                                                           ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-12 20:01                                                                                     ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-13 13:41                                                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-13 15:00                                                                                         ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-12 18:37                                                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-12 21:27                                                                                   ` Forth and others (Was Re: How to get Ada to ?cross the chasm??) Niklas Holsti
2018-05-13  2:21                                                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-13  3:20                                                                                       ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-13  3:34                                                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-13  6:33                                                                                           ` Simon Wright
2018-05-13 10:21                                                                                           ` Mart van de Wege
2018-05-13 12:43                                                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-13  8:06                                                                                     ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-09  8:25                                                                     ` How to get Ada to ?cross the chasm?? Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-08 21:43                                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-08 21:28                                                             ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-08 21:46                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-09  7:23                                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09  8:37                                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-09 19:41                                                                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-09 19:48                                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-08 21:02                                                         ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-08 21:34                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-06 19:02                                                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-06 18:38                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08 20:53                                                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-08 22:41                                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-07  1:49                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08 21:23                                                 ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-09  0:53                                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10 20:05                                                     ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-10 21:57                                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11 12:20                                                         ` Marius Amado-Alves
2018-05-11 16:34                                                           ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-11 17:39                                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11 18:59                                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11 19:50                                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11 20:32                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-12  1:04                                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11 20:39                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11 21:45                                                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-11 22:04                                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-12  6:44                                                                         ` J-P. Rosen
2018-05-11 19:58                                                                 ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-08 20:44                                         ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-08 21:31                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10 11:16                                             ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-10 19:32                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-04  0:59                                     ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2018-05-03  7:15                                 ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-03  7:20                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-03 12:05                                     ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-03 20:38                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-03 22:27                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-03 22:41                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-03 23:45                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-04  0:28                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-04 22:30                                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-09 20:03                                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09 20:15                                                     ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-09 20:41                                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09 22:56                                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-09 23:33                                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10  0:03                                                         ` Luke A. Guest
2018-05-10  0:23                                                           ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2018-05-10  1:53                                                             ` Luke A. Guest
2018-05-10  0:41                                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10  1:53                                                             ` Luke A. Guest
2018-05-10  2:07                                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10  7:29                                                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-10  3:47                                                             ` Shark8
2018-05-10  4:08                                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09 23:55                                                       ` Luke A. Guest
2018-05-10 22:10                                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-10  9:01                                                       ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-10 17:34                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10 19:11                                                           ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-10 19:36                                                             ` Simon Wright
2018-05-10 20:00                                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10 21:23                                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-10 23:21                                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11  1:32                                                                   ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-11  7:58                                                                     ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11  8:21                                                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11  7:04                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11  8:07                                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-10 22:15                                                               ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-10 23:32                                                               ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-11  0:05                                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11  2:54                                                                   ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-11  8:43                                                                   ` Niklas Holsti [this message]
2018-05-11  9:09                                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11  9:14                                                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11 13:07                                                                         ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-11 11:26                                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-11 21:24                                                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-11 13:09                                                                       ` Lucretia
2018-05-11 17:51                                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11 14:35                                                                       ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-05-11 21:09                                                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-04  7:15                                               ` Simon Wright
2018-05-04 22:02                                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-05  7:37                                                   ` Simon Wright
2018-05-07 20:40                                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-08 20:41                                           ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-08 21:00                                             ` Egil H H
2018-05-09 21:57                                               ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-09 22:05                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-09 22:05                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-09 22:09                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-11  7:37                                               ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-04  3:24                                         ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-04  3:34                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-04  4:28                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08  2:05                                               ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-08  2:19                                                 ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08  2:47                                                   ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-08  2:54                                                     ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-08  3:25                                                       ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-08  4:19                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08  5:46                                                     ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08  6:31                                                       ` Luke A. Guest
2018-05-08  6:34                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08 14:25                                                           ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-08  6:36                                                       ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-08  9:03                                                         ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08 14:05                                                           ` gautier_niouzes
2018-05-08 14:31                                                             ` Simon Wright
2018-05-08 16:39                                                               ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-05-08 18:54                                                             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-08 19:05                                                               ` Simon Wright
2018-05-08 20:12                                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-08 20:24                                                               ` J-P. Rosen
2018-05-09  9:27                                                                 ` Björn Lundin
2018-05-09  9:56                                                                   ` J-P. Rosen
2018-05-09 21:53                                                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-08  7:45                                                       ` Simon Wright
2018-05-08 21:59                                                       ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-09  8:44                                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-05-04 23:34                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-01 22:17                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-02  0:04                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-02 21:24                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-02 22:01                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 16:14                     ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-29 16:54                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 18:21                         ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-29 18:52                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 19:09                             ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-29 20:44                               ` Mehdi Saada
2018-04-29 20:55                             ` gautier_niouzes
2018-04-29 21:20                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 22:06                                 ` gautier_niouzes
2018-04-29 23:22                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-30  1:50                                     ` Jere
2018-04-30  2:16                                     ` Lucretia
2018-04-30  2:33                                       ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-30  3:05                                         ` Luke A. Guest
2018-04-30  3:37                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-30  4:02                                             ` Lucretia
2018-04-30  4:03                                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-30  4:18                                                 ` Lucretia
2018-04-30  5:11                                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-30  5:21                                                     ` Lucretia
2018-04-30  5:29                                                       ` Lucretia
2018-04-30  4:04                                             ` Lucretia
2018-04-30 14:30                                 ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-01  3:19                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-02  2:07                                   ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-01  2:32                             ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-02  0:47                               ` Paul Rubin
2018-04-29 11:34                   ` patrick
2018-07-13  8:22       ` jm.tarrasa
2018-07-13 15:17         ` Lucretia
2018-07-21 19:51         ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-25 23:19     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-04-28 17:13       ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-28 17:25         ` Mehdi Saada
2018-05-01  2:36           ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-01  2:32         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-01 18:39           ` marciant
2018-04-30  2:09     ` Commercial GPL David Trudgett
2018-04-30  6:01       ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-04-30 20:39     ` How to get Ada to ?cross the chasm?? Norman Worth
2018-04-30 21:36       ` Simon Wright
2018-05-02 14:39     ` ric.wai88
2018-05-02 17:10       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-02 22:48         ` Niklas Holsti
2018-05-03 17:00           ` Simon Wright
2018-05-03 17:58             ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-03 18:37             ` Dan'l Miller
2018-04-18 22:44 ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Olivier Henley
2018-04-30 11:28 ` Mehdi Saada
2018-04-30 12:39   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-04-30 11:30 ` Mehdi Saada
2018-04-30 20:15 ` Norman Worth
2018-05-04 16:13 ` guyclaude.burger
2018-05-04 16:47   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-04 23:48     ` How to get Ada to "cross the chasm"? Randy Brukardt
2018-05-05  3:33       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-05  8:41         ` Luke A. Guest
2018-05-06  0:12           ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-07 20:50           ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-07 21:13             ` Paul Rubin
2018-05-07 23:59               ` Randy Brukardt
2018-05-07 21:27             ` Dan'l Miller
2018-05-04 19:05   ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Jere
2018-05-04 23:55     ` How to get Ada to "cross the chasm"? Randy Brukardt
2018-05-05 16:47     ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? G.B.
2018-05-07 23:36       ` How to get Ada to "cross the chasm"? Randy Brukardt
2018-05-09  7:33         ` G.B.
2018-05-18 12:10 ` How to get Ada to “cross the chasm”? Lucretia
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2018-05-11 22:39 How to get Ada to 'cross the chasm'? Randy Brukardt
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