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From: Maciej Sobczak <see.my.homepage@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Teaching C/C++ from Ada perspective?
Date: Sat, 7 Jul 2018 13:43:43 -0700 (PDT)
Date: 2018-07-07T13:43:43-07:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <2f5399b4-518b-4a2e-9941-2ae267d51309@googlegroups.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1162d6bf-c226-4089-ae2e-870c7da9c80f@googlegroups.com>

> Because Steelman was one of the highest achievements in the history of humankind

Did you consider a career in politics or religion or both? :-)

> Do you have a suggestion for any other language-agnostic set of requirements that serves as a measuring stick for what is a software-engineering-facilitating programming language and what is not?

The measuring stick for me is whether I can convince others or whether others can convince me. This includes factors that extend beyond any hypothetical notion of "purity", or whatever that at the end the industry does not care about. Like "do I have access to compilers for the given language"? Because obviously a language without the compiler cannot be "facilitating" anything.
So I'm rather practice-oriented instead of religion-oriented.

> The -man series is clearly language agnostic

If it's the set of requirements for the Ada language, then obviously it is not agnostic.

> because no less than 6 quite-different programming languages

Nope. All of them wanted to become Ada.

> C++ was in a legally-protected zoo of sorts, not subjected to this natural selection

And this is where I object. The "natural selection" does not happen by committee. The closest industrial analogy to "natural selection" is the tool market, where users are ultimate judges. And this is the arena where your historical and sentimental links are both impressive and useless.
Think about more recent programming languages, which do not have. For some reason most of them try heavily to resemble C++, but you cannot blame AT&T for this any longer. Now it's somebody else's fault, but this is how "natural selection" works.

And, BTW, we were supposed to help the OP, who was asked to teach C++.

-- 
Maciej Sobczak * http://www.inspirel.com


  reply	other threads:[~2018-07-07 20:43 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 117+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-06-30 18:04 Teaching C/C++ from Ada perspective? kouaoua16
2018-06-30 18:15 ` Luke A. Guest
2018-06-30 19:27   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-06-30 19:07 ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-01 16:12 ` kouaoua16
2018-07-01 17:08   ` Luke A. Guest
2018-07-01 19:19     ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-02  6:12       ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-01 20:52 ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-01 21:35   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-02  5:56     ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-02  9:58       ` Marius Amado-Alves
2018-07-02 11:03         ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-02 13:52           ` Marius Amado-Alves
2018-07-04 12:10             ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-02 20:14         ` Paul Rubin
2018-07-03  9:48           ` Marius Amado-Alves
2018-07-04  2:52             ` Paul Rubin
2018-07-02 18:52       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-03  8:00         ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-03 12:40           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-03 20:54             ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-04  3:10               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-04  7:59                 ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-04  8:37                   ` Marius Amado-Alves
2018-07-04 12:22                     ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-04 14:13                       ` Simon Wright
2018-07-04 14:56                         ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-04 15:52                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-04 16:24                             ` Alejandro R. Mosteo
2018-07-04 20:00                               ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-07-05 18:35                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-05 19:39                                   ` Jeffrey R. Carter
2018-07-06 18:45                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-04 20:13                             ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-04 21:09                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-05  5:49                                 ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-05  7:37                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-05 13:14                                     ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-05 15:18                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-05 19:16                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-07 15:09                                         ` Lucretia
2018-07-05 19:12                                     ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-05 20:10                                       ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-06 19:01                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-06 19:35                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-05  7:43                                   ` Alejandro R. Mosteo
2018-07-05 18:53                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-05 19:06                                     ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-06 18:47                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-05 20:12                                     ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-06 18:51                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-06 19:43                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-06 20:18                                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-07  8:39                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2018-07-07 11:53                                           ` Björn Lundin
2018-07-06 20:22                                         ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-06 23:26                                           ` Paul Rubin
2018-07-07  6:17                                             ` J-P. Rosen
2018-07-07  6:37                                               ` Micronian Coder
2018-07-07  8:48                                                 ` Privacy and child packages (Was: Teaching C/C++ from Ada perspective?) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2018-07-07 20:19                                               ` Teaching C/C++ from Ada perspective? Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-08 15:25                                           ` Simon Wright
2018-07-08 20:00                                             ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-09  9:04                                               ` Alejandro R. Mosteo
2018-07-05 15:30                               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-05 20:38                                 ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-05 21:05                                   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-05 18:47                               ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-04 16:01                           ` Simon Wright
2018-07-04 17:12                           ` G. B.
2018-07-04 20:18                             ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-04 21:03                               ` G.B.
2018-07-04 17:21                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-04 20:36                             ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-04 22:44                               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-05  2:01                                 ` Luke A. Guest
2018-07-05  5:03                                   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-05  5:58                                 ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-05 19:25                                   ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-05 19:22                                 ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-05 18:31                       ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-06  3:32           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-06 12:05             ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-06 20:42             ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-06 21:32               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-07 20:43                 ` Maciej Sobczak [this message]
2018-07-08 17:36                   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-08 18:39                     ` Bill Findlay
2018-07-08 19:28                       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-09 12:34                         ` Bill Findlay
2018-07-09 15:19                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-09 19:34                             ` Bill Findlay
2018-07-09 22:03                               ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-09 22:35                                 ` Bill Findlay
2018-07-10  1:56                                   ` Lucretia
2018-07-10 23:14                         ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-11 14:05                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-11 20:20                             ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-08 20:43                     ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-08 23:17                       ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-09  6:13                         ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-09 16:35                           ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-10 23:20                       ` Randy Brukardt
2018-07-10 23:51                         ` Britt
2018-07-02 17:10   ` kouaoua16
2018-07-02 17:28     ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2018-07-02 18:22     ` Maciej Sobczak
2018-07-02 20:27     ` G.B.
2018-07-02  0:11 ` Paul Rubin
2018-07-02 14:26 ` kouaoua16
2018-07-02 19:57 ` G.B.
2018-07-02 20:17   ` Dan'l Miller
2018-07-03  9:56 ` Brian Drummond
2018-07-04 12:18 ` Olivier Henley
2018-07-04 14:17   ` kouaoua16
2018-07-12  5:38 ` robin.vowels
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