Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[William J. Thomas]

What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?

ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now?

It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by feeding 
them free dope and then start bleeding them.

What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K, 
please!!!!

Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.

William J. Thomas 

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Mark Lorenzen]

"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:

> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
> 
> ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now?
> 
> It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by feeding 
> them free dope and then start bleeding them.
> 
> What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K, 
> please!!!!
> 
> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
> 
> William J. Thomas 

What's wrong with gcc 3.4.3?

- Mark Lorenzen

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[William J. Thomas]

Is GCC 3.4.3 the new GNAT? In other words what is it and where do you 
download it from?

"Mark Lorenzen" <mark.lorenzen@ofir.dk> wrote in message 
news:m3d5wbil25.fsf@0x53589c0c.boanxx18.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk...
> "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
>
>> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
>>
>> ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now?
>>
>> It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by 
>> feeding
>> them free dope and then start bleeding them.
>>
>> What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K,
>> please!!!!
>>
>> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
>>
>> William J. Thomas
>
> What's wrong with gcc 3.4.3?
>
> - Mark Lorenzen 

Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?)

[israel t]

"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:

> Is GCC 3.4.3 the new GNAT? 
> In other words what is it


"GCC, the GNU Compiler Collection, includes front ends for C, C++, Objective-C, Fortran, Java, 
and Ada, as well as libraries for these languages (libstdc++, libgcj,...). "

> and where do you 
> download it from?

The usual places...... :-)

Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install
it for you.

If you are on redhat download the rpm
Otherwise download and compile the tarball.

If all else fails go to:
http://www.gnu.org/software/gcc/gcc.html

Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something

[Larry Kilgallen]

In article <87k6qjqvhq.fsf_-_@kafka.homenet>, israel t <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:

> Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install
> it for you.

You might want to mention the operating system to which that instruction
pertains, because I am fairly certain it is not VMS.

Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something

[Bobby D. Bryant]

On Wed, 12 Jan 2005, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote:

> In article <87k6qjqvhq.fsf_-_@kafka.homenet>, israel t <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:
> 
>> Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install
>> it for you.
> 
> You might want to mention the operating system to which that instruction
> pertains, because I am fairly certain it is not VMS.

Gentoo is a Linux distribution.

-- 
Bobby Bryant
Austin, Texas

Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something

[israel t]

Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:

> In article <87k6qjqvhq.fsf_-_@kafka.homenet>, israel t <rambam@bigpond.net.au> writes:
>
>> Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download , compile and install
>> it for you.
>
> You might want to mention the operating system to which that instruction
> pertains, because I am fairly certain it is not VMS.

Gentoo is a linux distribution.

Re: Isnt Gnat irrelevant ? ( was Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?)

[Martin Krischik]

<verï¿œffentlicht & per Mail versendet>

israel t wrote:

> "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
> 
>> Is GCC 3.4.3 the new GNAT?
>> In other words what is it
> 
> 
> "GCC, the GNU Compiler Collection, includes front ends for C, C++,
> Objective-C, Fortran, Java, and Ada, as well as libraries for these
> languages (libstdc++, libgcj,...). "
> 
>> and where do you
>> download it from?
> 
> The usual places...... :-)
> 
> Just type "emerge gcc " if you are using gentoo and portage will download
> , compile and install it for you.

Could you add gentoo to

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Programming:Ada:Installing

just hit the edit button and write a few words about the gentoo release

> If you are on redhat download the rpm
> Otherwise download and compile the tarball.
> 
> If all else fails go to:
> http://www.gnu.org/software/gcc/gcc.html

-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Pascal Obry]

"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:

> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?

Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???

> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.

See the GCC project.

Pascal.

-- 

--|------------------------------------------------------
--| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
--| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
--|------------------------------------------------------
--|              http://www.obry.org
--| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
--|
--| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Dowie]

Pascal Obry wrote:
> "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
>
>> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
>
> Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???
>
>> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
>
> See the GCC project.

I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and probably
for Windows) - as am I! :-)

I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want to
use the thing...

Cheers

-- Martin

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Manuel Collado]

Martin Dowie wrote:

> Pascal Obry wrote:
> 
>>"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
>>
>>>What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
>>
>>Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???
>>
>>>Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
>>
>>See the GCC project.
> 
> I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and probably
> for Windows) - as am I! :-)
> 
> I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want to
> use the thing...

So:

Cygwin (for Windows) - http://cygwin.com/ - includes gcc-ada 3.3.1

Mingw (for Windows) - http://www.mingw.org/ - includes gcc-ada 3.4.2

DJGPP (for DOS/Windows) - http://www.delorie.com/djgpp/ - includes 
gcc-ada 3.4.3

All these distributions include binaries, sources and documentation.
-- 
To reply by e-mail, please remove the extra dot
in the given address:  m.collado -> mcollado

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

<verï¿œffentlicht & per Mail versendet>

Manuel Collado wrote:

> Martin Dowie wrote:
> 
>> Pascal Obry wrote:
>> 
>>>"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
>>>
>>>>What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
>>>
>>>Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???
>>>
>>>>Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
>>>
>>>See the GCC project.
>> 
>> I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and
>> probably for Windows) - as am I! :-)
>> 
>> I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want
>> to use the thing...
> 
> So:
> 
> Cygwin (for Windows) - http://cygwin.com/ - includes gcc-ada 3.3.1
> 
> Mingw (for Windows) - http://www.mingw.org/ - includes gcc-ada 3.4.2
> 
> DJGPP (for DOS/Windows) - http://www.delorie.com/djgpp/ - includes
> gcc-ada 3.4.3

Could you add DJGPP to 

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Programming:Ada:Installing

just hit the edit button and write a few words about it.

> All these distributions include binaries, sources and documentation.
> --
> To reply by e-mail, please remove the extra dot
> in the given address:  m.collado -> mcollado

Martin
-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Manuel Collado]

Martin Krischik wrote:

> Manuel Collado wrote:
> ...
>>DJGPP (for DOS/Windows) - http://www.delorie.com/djgpp/ - includes
>>gcc-ada 3.4.3
> 
> Could you add DJGPP to 
> 
> http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Programming:Ada:Installing
> 
> just hit the edit button and write a few words about it.

Done.
-- 
To reply by e-mail, please remove the extra dot
in the given address:  m.collado -> mcollado

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Luke A. Guest]

On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 10:18:32 +0000, Martin Dowie wrote:

> Pascal Obry wrote:
>> "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
>>
>>> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
>>
>> Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???
>>
>>> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
>>
>> See the GCC project.
> 
> I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and probably
> for Windows) - as am I! :-)
> 

The state of GNAT for Win32 is better than the same for Linux. Mingw32
doesn't build on Linux, so cross compiler are out of the window, but it
does build on Win32, and it includes the tools that aren't included in the
equivalent GNAT under Linux, e.g. gnatmem, gnatprep.

Luke.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[William J. Thomas]

"Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message 
news:uwtujqbtw.fsf@obry.net...
>
> "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
>
>> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
>
> Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???

I've been doing what I've been doing since 1983, developing systems in Ada. 
The thing is I develop them for companies that don't have to compile their 
compilers, they buy them, for lots of money :)

>> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
>
> See the GCC project.
>
> Pascal.
>
> -- 
>
> --|------------------------------------------------------
> --| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
> --| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
> --|------------------------------------------------------
> --|              http://www.obry.org
> --| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
> --|
> --| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595 

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Pascal Obry]

"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:

> "Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message 
> news:uwtujqbtw.fsf@obry.net...
> >
> > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
> >
> >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
> >
> > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???
> 
> I've been doing what I've been doing since 1983, developing systems in Ada. 
> The thing is I develop them for companies that don't have to compile their 
> compilers, they buy them, for lots of money :)

No problem, but in this case do not step in sayings "What ever happend to this
whole concept of a free Ada compiler?"

It is there, period. Maybe you should ask something like:

  Where can I download an Ada compiler for my system ?

Your sentence above seemed to imply that something was really wrong :)

Pascal.

-- 

--|------------------------------------------------------
--| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
--| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
--|------------------------------------------------------
--|              http://www.obry.org
--| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
--|
--| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

William J. Thomas wrote:

> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
> 
> ACT has not released a public version for what over two years now?
> 
> It seems like ACT went the "drug dealer" route, get them addicted by
> feeding them free dope and then start bleeding them.
> 
> What's a one person ACT "maintenance" license go for these days >4K,
> please!!!!

Last time I asked there was ony a 5 developer licences. 

Martin
-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Nick Roberts]

"William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> wrote:

> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
> ...

I am writing a new Ada compiler, called ECLAT, that will be released under
the GPL. It will initially target the AdaOS native format (NEAI), but I hope
to get around to making it target COFF at some point. But don't hold your
breath; I'm afraid it will probably be many years before ECLAT is working.

-- 
Nick Roberts

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Robert C. Leif]

   Martin Dowie wrote. "I don't have the time to look into how to build a
compiler - I just want to use the thing..."
   As I stated before, I also wish to just use GNAT.  Of greater
significance, how will people new to Ada use GNAT without a simple way to
download it?
   Does anything in the Ada Core license prevent any of the Ada experts from
setting up a site to download the latest public version of GNAT?  My
suggestion is for one of the author's of an Ada textbook to have the latest
free version of GNAT located at the same site as his or her book.  We also
have the problem that A# depends on GNAT.
   Bob Leif
   ----------------------------------------
   Message: 2
   Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 10:18:32 -0000
   From: "Martin Dowie" <martin.dowie@baesystems.com>
   Subject: Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?
   To: comp.lang.ada@ada-france.org
   Message-ID: <41e4f7ef$1_1@baen1673807.greenlnk.net>
   
   Pascal Obry wrote:
   > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
   >
   >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
   >
   > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???
   >
   >> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
   >
   > See the GCC project.
   
   I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and
probably
   for Windows) - as am I! :-)
   
   I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just want
to use the thing...
   
   Cheers
   
   -- Martin

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Bernd Specht]

>    Pascal Obry wrote:
>   > "William J. Thomas" <wjthomas@wcvt.com> writes:
>   >
>   >> What ever happend to this whole concept of a free Ada compiler?
>   >
>   > Where were you this last monthes ? In another planet ???
>   >
>   >> Well anyway, this ought to kick up some dust.
>   >
>   > See the GCC project.
>    
>    I think the original poster is looking for a pre-built release (and
> probably
>    for Windows) - as am I! :-)
>    
>    I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just
>    want 
> to use the thing...
>    
>    Cheers
>    
>    -- Martin
> 
> 

Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If 
you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the sources", 
"Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ... (bla bla)

And  if you state that you work (e.g.) with C because there is no Ada 
compiler for your environmemt, then you get only replies "you are very 
stupid *not* to use Ada ..." (ha ha).

Ada community seems full of advocats, but technicians are missing. 

Those wise guys always stating that you have to read thousands of documents 
and working years on things you are not interessted in, then build your own 
toolchains, are responsible for decreasing Ada-use.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Jerry Petrey]

Bernd Specht wrote:

>
> Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If
> you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the sources",
> "Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ... (bla bla)
>
> And  if you state that you work (e.g.) with C because there is no Ada
> compiler for your environmemt, then you get only replies "you are very
> stupid *not* to use Ada ..." (ha ha).
>
> Ada community seems full of advocats, but technicians are missing.
>
> Those wise guys always stating that you have to read thousands of documents
> and working years on things you are not interessted in, then build your own
> toolchains, are responsible for decreasing Ada-use.

Bernd,

I�m afraid you are right.  I think Ada is the best language for most
applications today except for the lack of support and tools.  I have been using
it exclusively for the last 15 years and have been fortunate to find good
paying jobs using it but the handwriting is definitely on the wall for this to
come to an end.  We have enough big programs at Raytheon using Ada to keep me
busy until I retire in a few years but none of our new programs will even
consider using Ada.  Most of our new engineers either have never heard of it or
consider it a relic from the past and want nothing to do with it.  Like some of
the other posters said � when you�re looking for a compiler for a certain
language, you want to have some complete, well supported and easy to use
choices � not have to build them yourself.  GNAT was at least close to what was
needed but ACT seems to have abandoned the public releases � which means even
fewer new users will have an easily obtained, modern Ada compiler to try out
and thus even fewer applications will use Ada.

If the Ada vendors can�t make good, reasonably priced Ada toolsets available to
individual engineers, where do they think their future customers are going to
come from?

I think the suggestion for some GNAT Pro users to make the latest release
available would be step in the right direction but a lot of work is needed if
we are going to save Ada.  I saw the same thing happen to Forth, which I liked
and used back in the 80�s.

Jerry

---------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Jerry Petrey   -   Senior Principal Systems Engineer
-- Navigation (GPS/INS), Guidance, & Control
-- Raytheon Missile Systems  - Member Team Ada & Team Forth
-- NOTE: please perform appendectomy on email address before replying
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Georg Bauhaus]

Jerry Petrey <jdpetreyAPPENDIX@raytheon.com> wrote:
: 
: 
: Bernd Specht wrote:
: 
:> Ada community seems full of advocats, but technicians are missing.

Where would you place them when it comes to making the decision
which compiler to supply for a hardware offering?

:> Those wise guys always stating that you have to read thousands of documents
:> and working years on things you are not interessted in, then build your own
:> toolchains, are responsible for decreasing Ada-use.
 
: I?m afraid you are right.  I think Ada is the best language for most
: applications today except for the lack of support and tools.  I have been using
: it exclusively for the last 15 years and have been fortunate to find good
: paying jobs using it but the handwriting is definitely on the wall for this to
: come to an end.  We have enough big programs at Raytheon using Ada to keep me
: busy until I retire in a few years but none of our new programs will even
: consider using Ada.  Most of our new engineers either have never heard of it or
: consider it a relic from the past and want nothing to do with it.  Like some of
: the other posters said ? when you?re looking for a compiler for a certain
: language, you want to have some complete, well supported and easy to use
: choices ? not have to build them yourself.

AFAICT, GPS is well supported, and part of the delivery in the
academic program that has started recently.
The situation with SPARK is similar, I believe.
ObjectAda is supported as well, at various levels.
I don't think that Ada's public visibility has a lot to do with
supported toolsets.
(Seems like there are similar stories of regret about Eiffel (and other
languages). You can get a sufficiently impressive IDE for Eifel, you can
get integration with the numerically most popular IDE on the
numerically most popular OS. You get all this for free. Still...)

You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write a
killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which could
be considered less popular :-) Like:
"MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005".

There have been rumors that Ada for .NET is being interated into
Visual Studio. Aonix is apparently integrating their compiler
with Eclipse.  Will this change anything? A recent discussion
somewhere else that insisted on C-like syntax for language design makes
me think otherwise.

For example, if I look at the language D (available from
digitalmars.com), I feel very much at home because almost all
of the language D is already available in Ada. OTOH, all the
programmers preferring curly braces appear to feel at home as
well, because of the curly braces, and because of the cool
new features they hadn't known before. No need for them to "go
back" to languages of the past, no need to consider whether the
pals will still like them if they did "go back" ;-)


-- Georg

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Bernd Specht]

Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in
news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de: 

> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write
> a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which
> could be considered less popular :-) Like:
> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005".

Georg,

this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be done", 
but - nobody *does*!

I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must do 
...", but never found one who *did*.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Bernd Specht wrote:

> Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in
> news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de:
> 
>> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write
>> a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which
>> could be considered less popular :-) Like:
>> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005".
> 
> Georg,
> 
> this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be done",
> but - nobody *does*!
> 
> I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must do
> ...", but never found one who *did*.

You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside
(http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am doing!
And I don't think you want me to either, do you?

Martin

-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Jeff C]

"Martin Krischik" <martin@krischik.com> wrote in message 
news:4244894.mjszBdT2aV@linux1.krischik.com...
> Bernd Specht wrote:
>
>> Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in
>> news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de:
>>
>>> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps write
>>> a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application, which
>>> could be considered less popular :-) Like:
>>> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005".
>>
>> Georg,
>>
>> this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be 
>> done",
>> but - nobody *does*!
>>
>> I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must do
>> ...", but never found one who *did*.
>
> You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside
> (http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am 
> doing!
> And I don't think you want me to either, do you?
>
> Martin
>
> -- 
> mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
> http://www.ada.krischik.com


Now, now.. We don't want actual facts to cloud his argument. Isn't it better
to just make unsubstantiated silly claims.

I'll try one so we can all get the hang of it.... You know the problem with 
C programmers
is they get so discouraged hunting down all the bugs in their programs that 
they
give up for hours on end and go read newsgroups for languages that they can
only dream about being smart enough to use. After all the nice thing about
C is that if you fall asleep on the keyboard  you are likely to create a 
program
that compiles

 for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2);


I have figured out one thing that I know "must be done" that I have not 
actually
done yet and that is to add a new entry to my kill/ignore file in my 
newsreader.

Of course the worst thing about this thread is that it proves that even 
after all of these
years I still can't help but feed the trolls.. They are just so cute and 
cuddly.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Jeff C wrote:

 
>  for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2);

;-)

Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P() does
not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return value at
all - but it must exist somewhere.

Martin
-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Keith Thompson]

Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> writes:
> Jeff C wrote:
>
>  
>>  for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2);
>
> ;-)
>
> Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P() does
> not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return value at
> all - but it must exist somewhere.

It won't compile at all; it has two syntax errors.  "R-" should be
"R--", and "e-" should be "e--".

It still won't compile without appropriate declarations for R, e, C,
and U -- and in C99 it's illegal without a function declarations for P.

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
San Diego Supercomputer Center             <*>  <http://users.sdsc.edu/~kst>
We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Keith Thompson wrote:

> Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> writes:
>> Jeff C wrote:
>>
>>  
>>>  for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2);
>>
>> ;-)
>>
>> Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P()
>> does not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return
>> value at all - but it must exist somewhere.
> 
> It won't compile at all; it has two syntax errors.  "R-" should be
> "R--", and "e-" should be "e--".
> 
> It still won't compile without appropriate declarations for R, e, C,
> and U -- and in C99 it's illegal without a function declarations for P.

If only there was any C99 compiler. We have 2005 - name me one fully
compliant C99 compiler!

Actualy: Name me one company which is *truely* (no vaporware) commited to
provide a C99 compiler!

AFAIK only the Free Software Fondation is  *truely* commited to provide a
C99 compiler - but they are no where close.

With Regards

Martin

PS: Maybe I should cross post to comp.lang.c - not for a flame war - but
because I would be actualy interested to know if where a C99 compiler
somewhere out there.
-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Adrien Plisson]

Martin Krischik wrote:
> If only there was any C99 compiler. We have 2005 - name me one fully
> compliant C99 compiler!

isn't digitalmars supposed to be C99 compliant ?

i know this compiler is way better standard compliant than many other 
commercial compilers, but i don't know how much of the standard it 
complies to.

(for more information we may have a look at www.digitalmars.com)

-- 
rien

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Adrien Plisson wrote:

> Martin Krischik wrote:
>> If only there was any C99 compiler. We have 2005 - name me one fully
>> compliant C99 compiler!
> 
> isn't digitalmars supposed to be C99 compliant ?

At least they have

static and type-qualifier-list now supported for array dimension per C99
6.7.5.2.

where gcc is still struggeling. I don't know where the problem is: Ada and
ISO-Pascal have got that feature for decades now.

> i know this compiler is way better standard compliant than many other
> commercial compilers, but i don't know how much of the standard it
> complies to.

They unimlemented feature lists are indeed very short:

C:

New struct member initializer syntax 
tgmath.h 
_Pragma

C++:

Distinction between dependent and non-dependent name lookup. 
Template template parameters. 
export keyword. 
Enums larger than an int.

But still they are not nil. Could it be that the former "slim" langugages C
and C++ have gone the way of PL/1: Become so complex that implemting the
*full* standart is impossible?

With Regards

Martin

-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Steve]

To find interesting C code, you need go no further than 
http://www0.us.ioccc.org/years.html.

Here is an example of the source to anonymous.c:
                                  #include\
                                  <stdio.h>
                     #include                <stdlib.h>
                     #include                <string.h>

                    #define w "Hk~HdA=Jk|Jk~LSyL[{M[wMcxNksNss:"
                   #define r"Ht@H|@=HdJHtJHdYHtY:HtFHtF=JDBIl"\
                  "DJTEJDFIlMIlM:HdMHdM=I|KIlMJTOJDOIlWITY:8Y"
                 #define S"IT@I\\@=HdHHtGH|KILJJDIJDH:H|KID"\
                "K=HdQHtPH|TIDRJDRJDQ:JC?JK?=JDRJLRI|UItU:8T"
               #define _(i,j)L[i=2*T[j,O[i=O[j-R[j,T[i=2*\
              R[j-5*T[j+4*O[j-L[j,R[i=3*T[j-R[j-3*O[j+L[j,
             #define t"IS?I\\@=HdGHtGIDJILIJDIItHJTFJDF:8J"

    #define y                  yy(4),yy(5),                yy(6),yy(7)
  #define yy(              i)R[i]=T[i],T[i ]            =O[i],O[i]=L [i]
#define Y _(0          ], 4] )_ (1 ], 5] )_ (2      ], 6] )_ (3 ], 7] )_=1
#define v(i)(      (( R[ i ] * _ + T [ i ]) * _ + O [ i ]) * _ + L [ i ]) *2
double b = 32  ,l ,k ,o ,B ,_ ; int Q , s , V , R [8 ], T[ 8] ,O [8 ], L[ 8] 
;
#define q( Q,R ) R= *X ++ % 64 *8 ,R |= *X /8 &7 
,Q=*X++%8,Q=Q*64+*X++%64-256,
# define  p      "G\\QG\\P=GLPGTPGdMGdNGtOGlOG" 
"dSGdRGDPGLPG\\LG\\LHtGHtH:"
#  define W         "Hs?H{?=HdGH|FI\\II\\GJlHJ" 
"lFL\\DLTCMlAM\\@Ns}Nk|:8G"
# define   U           "EDGEDH=EtCElDH{~H|AJk}" 
"Jk?LSzL[|M[wMcxNksNst:"
#  define u                  "Hs?H|@=HdFHtEI"             "\\HI\\FJLHJTD:8H"
char  *   x                   ,*X , ( * i )[               640],z[3]="4_",
*Z = "4,8O4.8O4G" r U "4M"u S"4R"u 
t"4S8CHdDH|E=HtAIDAIt@IlAJTCJDCIlKI\\K:8K"U
 "4TDdWDdW=D\\UD\\VF\\FFdHGtCGtEIDBIDDIlBIdDJT@JLC:8D"t"4UGDNG\\L=GDJGLKHL\
FHLGHtEHtE:"p"4ZFDTFLT=G|EGlHITBH|DIlDIdE:HtMH|M=JDBJLDKLAKDALDFKtFKdMK\
\\LJTOJ\\NJTMJTM:8M4aGtFGlG=G|HG|H:G\\IG\\J=G|IG|I:GdKGlL=G|JG|J:4b"W
S"4d"W t t"4g"r w"4iGlIGlK=G|JG|J:4kHl@Ht@=HdDHtCHdPH|P:HdDHdD=It\
BIlDJTEJDFIdNI\\N:8N"w"4lID@IL@=HlIH|FHlPH|NHt^H|^:H|MH|N=J\\D\
J\\GK\\OKTOKDXJtXItZI|YIlWI|V:8^4mHLGH\\G=HLVH\\V:4n" u t t
"4p"W"IT@I\\@=HdHHtGIDKILIJLGJLG:JK?JK?=JDGJLGI|MJDL:8M4\
rHt@H|@=HtDH|BJdLJTH:ITEI\\E=ILPILNNtCNlB:8N4t"W t"4u"
p"4zI[?Il@=HlHH|HIDLILIJDII|HKDAJ|A:JtCJtC=JdLJtJL\
THLdFNk|Nc|\
:8K"; main (
int C,char**        A) {for(x=A[1],i=calloc(strlen(x)+2,163840);
C-1;C<3?Q=_=       0,(z[1]=*x++)?((*x++==104?z[1]^=32:--x), X =
strstr(Z,z))      &&(X+=C++):(printf("P2 %d 320 4 ",V=b/2+32),
V*=2,s=Q=0,C     =4):C<4?Q-->0?i[(int)((l+=o)+b)][(int)(k+=B)
]=1:_?_-=.5/    256,o=(v(2)-(l=v(0)))/(Q=16),B=(v(3)-(k=v(1)
))/Q:*X>60?y   ,q(L[4],L[5])q(L[6],L[7])*X-61||(++X,y,y,y),
Y:*X>57?++X,  y,Y:*X >54?++X,b+=*X++%64*4:--C:printf("%d "
,i[Q][s]+i[Q ][s+1]+i[Q+1][s]+i[Q+1][s+1])&&(Q+=2)<V||(Q=
0,s+=2)<640
||(C=1));}Now wouldn't that be a lot more boring in Ada?

Steve
(The Duck)

"Martin Krischik" <martin@krischik.com> wrote in message 
news:1308622.IPB2vGgG6q@linux1.krischik.com...
> Jeff C wrote:
>
>
>>  for(;P("\n"),R-;P("|"))for(e=C;e-;P("_"+(*u++/8)%2))P("| "+(*u/4)%2);
>
> ;-)
>
> Of corse it will only link when there is a function P() somewhere. P() 
> does
> not nessesarly need take a char* as parameter or have any return value at
> all - but it must exist somewhere.
>
> Martin
> -- 
> mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
> http://www.ada.krischik.com 

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Bernd Specht]

"Jeff C" <jcreem@yahoo.com> wrote in
news:2qGdnRHihtRhI3rcRVn-uA@comcast.com: 

> 
> 
> Now, now.. We don't want actual facts to cloud his argument. Isn't it
> better to just make unsubstantiated silly claims.

This is exactly what I said. You say "we make Ada, we are the greatest, all 
others shall piss off". This is not helpful, to get more people interessted 
in Ada. 

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Bernd Specht]

Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> wrote in
news:4244894.mjszBdT2aV@linux1.krischik.com: 

> Bernd Specht wrote:
> 
>> Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in
>> news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de:
>> 
>>> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps
>>> write a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application,
>>> which could be considered less popular :-) Like:
>>> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005".
>> 
>> Georg,
>> 
>> this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be
>> done", but - nobody *does*! 
>> 
>> I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must
>> do ...", but never found one who *did*.
> 
> You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside
> (http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am
> doing!

Sure, thats correct. But, in fact, your software is not well know to a broad 
public, isn't it? Thats the problem. To make ada more popular, we would need 
more software that is known to the people (like the DB mentioned by George).

> And I don't think you want me to either, do you?

No, not really. BTW, as far as I see, your projects are all GNAT related, 
this will not make it interessting for people *outside* the Ada-community.
 
> Martin

Bernd 

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Bernd Specht wrote:

> Martin Krischik <martin@krischik.com> wrote in
> news:4244894.mjszBdT2aV@linux1.krischik.com:
> 
>> Bernd Specht wrote:
>> 
>>> Georg Bauhaus <sb463ba@l1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de> wrote in
>>> news:cs5jj0$mrp$1@a1-hrz.uni-duisburg.de:
>>> 
>>>> You'd have to change professors, or history, and fashion, perhaps
>>>> write a killer application in Ada (maybe not a killing application,
>>>> which could be considered less popular :-) Like:
>>>> "MySQL is currently being rewritten in Ada 2005".
>>> 
>>> Georg,
>>> 
>>> this exactly the problem: everyone here seems to know what "must be
>>> done", but - nobody *does*!
>>> 
>>> I've read many (really much) threads here were people wrote "one must
>>> do ...", but never found one who *did*.
>> 
>> You are unfair. I can't copy the content of my webside
>> (http://www.ada.krischik.com) into every post just to show what I am
>> doing!
> 
> Sure, thats correct. But, in fact, your software is not well know to a
> broad public, isn't it?

True. Alltrue sarDO is a lot more usefull then sed. But then any commandline
text editor is not for the broad public.

> Thats the problem. To make ada more popular, we 
> would need more software that is known to the people (like the DB
> mentioned by George).

Yes. That is true. I belive that GNAVI would be good. You need the
foundation (develoment tools) first. Of corse GNAVI with integrated DB
would be even better.

The first step of the Ada comunity should be to give up on our tiny pet
project and intergrate them into something larger wich then has the power
to create those great applications.

>> And I don't think you want me to either, do you?
> 
> No, not really. BTW, as far as I see, your projects are all GNAT related,
> this will not make it interessting for people *outside* the Ada-community.

I have done lots of work with "Export (C," as well. They are just not
integated into main AdaCL.

Martin

-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Dowie]

Bernd Specht wrote:
>>   I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just
>>   want to use the thing...
>>   
>>   Cheers
>>   
>>   -- Martin
>>
> 
> Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If 
> you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the sources", 
> "Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ... (bla bla)

Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just 
downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it 
doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that?

So now I have both gnat-3.15p and gcc-3.4.2 with GPS!

If MinGW is only 3-4 months behind the GCC releases that's a period I 
can easily cope with.

Cheers

-- Martin

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Martin Dowie wrote:

> Bernd Specht wrote:
>>>   I don't have the time to look into how to build a compiler - I just
>>>   want to use the thing...
>>>   
>>>   Cheers
>>>   
>>>   -- Martin
>>>
>> 
>> Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do?
>> If you ask for Ada for xy you get replies like: "Build it from the
>> sources", "Use a Ada to C", "Pay for development, then you will get" ...
>> (bla bla)
> 
> Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just
> downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it
> doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that?

Here me:

http://gnat-asis.sourceforge.net/

Martin
-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Dowie]

>>Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just
>>downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it
>>doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that?
> 
> 
> Here me:
> 
> http://gnat-asis.sourceforge.net/

There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is 
the 3.4.0 branch suitable?

Cheers

-- Martin

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Martin Dowie wrote:

>>>Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just
>>>downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it
>>>doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that?
>> 
>> 
>> Here me:
>> 
>> http://gnat-asis.sourceforge.net/
> 
> There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is
> the 3.4.0 branch suitable?

The download packages are cummulative - newer version contain the old
version as well - so use the newest. Sadly in the current package
the /gnat-3.4.2/ is indeed empty. You may try to use gnat-3.4.1 instead.

But for MinGW it would be better to use the sources from 
gcc-ada-3.4.2-20040916-1-src.tar.gz

Copy the follwing sources from the src pack to the gnat directory:

GNAT_Specs :=   \
  ./alloc.ads  \
  ./atree.ads  \
  ./casing.ads \
  ./csets.ads  \
  ./debug.ads  \
  ./einfo.ads  \
  ./elists.ads \
  ./fname.ads  \
  ./gnatvsn.ads \
  ./hostparm.ads \
  ./krunch.ads \
  ./lib.ads  \
  ./namet.ads  \
  ./nlists.ads \
  ./opt.ads  \
  ./output.ads \
  ./repinfo.ads \
  ./scans.ads  \
  ./sinfo.ads  \
  ./sinput.ads \
  ./snames.ads \
  ./stand.ads  \
  ./stringt.ads \
  ./table.ads  \
  ./tree_in.ads \
  ./tree_io.ads \
  ./types.ads  \
  ./uintp.ads  \
  ./uname.ads  \
  ./urealp.ads \
  ./widechar.ads \
  ./g-string.ads

GNAT_Body :=   \
  ./atree.adb  \
  ./casing.adb \
  ./csets.adb  \
  ./debug.adb  \
  ./einfo.adb  \
  ./elists.adb \
  ./fname.adb  \
  ./gnatvsn.adb \
  ./krunch.adb \
  ./lib.adb  \
  ./lib-list.adb \
  ./lib-sort.adb \
  ./namet.adb  \
  ./nlists.adb \
  ./opt.adb  \
  ./output.adb \
  ./repinfo.adb \
  ./scans.adb  \
  ./sinfo.adb  \
  ./sinput.adb \
  ./snames.adb \
  ./stand.adb  \
  ./stringt.adb \
  ./table.adb  \
  ./tree_in.adb \
  ./tree_io.adb \
  ./types.adb  \
  ./uintp.adb  \
  ./uname.adb  \
  ./urealp.adb \
  ./widechar.adb \
  ./g-string.adb

GNAT_C :=    \
  ./version.c  \
  ./version.h

If you have a sourceforge user I give you write access to the cvs archive so
you can make the change available to other users.

Martin
-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Dowie]

Martin Krischik wrote:
> Martin Dowie wrote:
>>There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is
>>the 3.4.0 branch suitable?
> 
> 
> The download packages are cummulative - newer version contain the old
> version as well - so use the newest. Sadly in the current package
> the /gnat-3.4.2/ is indeed empty. You may try to use gnat-3.4.1 instead.
> 
> But for MinGW it would be better to use the sources from 
> gcc-ada-3.4.2-20040916-1-src.tar.gz
> 
> Copy the follwing sources from the src pack to the gnat directory:
> 
> GNAT_Specs :=   \
[snip]

> 
> If you have a sourceforge user I give you write access to the cvs archive so
> you can make the change available to other users.

Yes, I am a sf user (userid "martindowie").

But I'm still missing something - I can't see a "3.4.1" pack in either 
the 'Files' sf page or as a branch within the "CVS" page. There is a 
"3.4.0"...

Cheers

-- Martin

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Martin Dowie wrote:

> Martin Krischik wrote:
>> Martin Dowie wrote:
>>>There doesn't appear to be a version (specifically) for GCC 3.4.2 - is
>>>the 3.4.0 branch suitable?
>> 
>> 
>> The download packages are cummulative - newer version contain the old
>> version as well - so use the newest. Sadly in the current package
>> the /gnat-3.4.2/ is indeed empty. You may try to use gnat-3.4.1 instead.
>> 
>> But for MinGW it would be better to use the sources from
>> gcc-ada-3.4.2-20040916-1-src.tar.gz
>> 
>> Copy the follwing sources from the src pack to the gnat directory:
>> 
>> GNAT_Specs :=   \
> [snip]
> 
>> 
>> If you have a sourceforge user I give you write access to the cvs archive
>> so you can make the change available to other users.
> 
> Yes, I am a sf user (userid "martindowie").

Welcome to the team!

> But I'm still missing something - I can't see a "3.4.1" pack in either
> the 'Files' sf page or as a branch within the "CVS" page. There is a
> "3.4.0"...

You missunderstood. The Version number only applies to the binary created.
The source package also contains all other versions collected up until
then. You find them in the ".../gnat/gnat-3.x.x/" directories. 

However I alse check the cvs archive right now and update it if needed.
Also, if needed I make a release ready next week.

Martin
-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Jeff C]

If you are thinking about using the mingw version of Ada be aware
that the debugger included in mingw is really not Ada aware and that the
debugger the mingw project is currently releasing is a pretty old version
of gdb (5.x series v.s. a 6.x series).


I have both a mingw environment and a cygwin environment setup on
my machine. I grabbed the latest 6.3 based ACT snapshot gdb from the libre 
site
(you can view the CVS of it at
http://libre.adacore.com/cvsweb/gdb-6.3/)

And built this under cygwin (need --disable-nls and make sure you have
thinks like flex and bison setup in your cygwin environment).

Then, by putting the resulting gdb along with a cygwin.dll in the path you 
can
run this resulting gdb on your mingw compiled Ada code without ever really
firing up a cygwin shell.  I have not used this debugger extensively but I 
can
confirm it works better than the one currently shipping with mingw.

I don't really have time to package this correctly and I really can't send
the binary (without including the source, having the source or a written 
offer to provide it
for some time).

But if someone tries this and runs into any issues I can answer a few 
questions.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Jeffrey Carter]

Martin Dowie wrote:
> 
> Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just 
> downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it 
> doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that?

Yeah, but 50 MB? All I want is the compiler.

-- 
Jeff Carter
"Help! Help! I'm being repressed!"
Monty Python & the Holy Grail
67

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Pascal Obry]

Jeffrey Carter <spam@spam.com> writes:

> Yeah, but 50 MB? All I want is the compiler.

No. You want the at least Ada compiler, the binutils, GNU/make, the MingW
runtime, the MingW includes, the MingW libraries ;)

Pascal.

-- 

--|------------------------------------------------------
--| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
--| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
--|------------------------------------------------------
--|              http://www.obry.org
--| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
--|
--| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Martin Krischik]

Jeffrey Carter wrote:

> Martin Dowie wrote:
>> 
>> Well, it turns out I _didn't_ need to build it myself - I've just
>> downloaded "MinGW 3.2 rc-1" and it installed rather nicely. Shame it
>> doesn't seem to have ASIS - anyone working on that?
> 
> Yeah, but 50 MB? All I want is the compiler.

Compiler alone does not realy help. And compared with the 4 CDs Visual
Stutio takes its lightweigt.

With Regards

Martin

-- 
mailto://krischik@users.sourceforge.net
http://www.ada.krischik.com

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Pascal Obry]

Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes:

> Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do? If 

And you are proposing what to change that ?

Pascal.

-- 

--|------------------------------------------------------
--| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
--| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
--|------------------------------------------------------
--|              http://www.obry.org
--| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
--|
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Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Bernd Specht]

Pascal Obry <pascal@obry.net> wrote in news:ullax2nlm.fsf@obry.net:

> 
> Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes:
> 
>> Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never
>> do? If 
> 
> And you are proposing what to change that ?
> 
> Pascal.
> 

*I* propose nothing. I made my decision. I use C.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Pascal Obry]

Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes:

> *I* propose nothing. I made my decision. I use C.

Good, do you know comp.lang.c then.

Pascal.

-- 

--|------------------------------------------------------
--| Pascal Obry                           Team-Ada Member
--| 45, rue Gabriel Peri - 78114 Magny Les Hameaux FRANCE
--|------------------------------------------------------
--|              http://www.obry.org
--| "The best way to travel is by means of imagination"
--|
--| gpg --keyserver wwwkeys.pgp.net --recv-key C1082595

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Randy Brukardt]

"Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message
news:ullax2nlm.fsf@obry.net...
>
> Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes:
>
> > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never do?
If
>
> And you are proposing what to change that ?

Talk some more, I'm sure. That's what news groups are about after all; they
primarily suck up time that could be used to *do* something. For the people
that are professional Ada developers, it probably sucks up most of their Ada
time...

Some of us have been *do*ing for years. It hasn't helped, as far as I can
tell.

                   Randy.

Re: Will the World ever see something beyond GNAT 3.15p?

[Bernd Specht]

"Randy Brukardt" <randy@rrsoftware.com> wrote in
news:SfednedI4sPvQXvcRVn-iQ@megapath.net: 

> "Pascal Obry" <pascal@obry.net> wrote in message
> news:ullax2nlm.fsf@obry.net...
>>
>> Bernd.Specht@gmx.com (Bernd Specht) writes:
>>
>> > Well, but isn't this the speciallity of Ada? Always talk, but never
>> > do? If 
>>
>> And you are proposing what to change that ?
> 
> Talk some more, I'm sure. That's what news groups are about after all;
> they primarily suck up time that could be used to *do* something. For
> the people that are professional Ada developers, it probably sucks up
> most of their Ada time...
> 
> Some of us have been *do*ing for years. It hasn't helped, as far as I
> can tell.
> 
>                    Randy.
> 

The problem is *not* to use Ada for daily work, because this will not make 
Ada more visible. Less people know how the software for boing, airbus, iss 
is written. But - many people know e.g. Apache, CDrecord, Gimp, Linux and so  
on and they know that they are *not* written in Ada. 
So *doing* means not do commercial work, doing means popular, public 
programs. If there were a photoshop-clone for Linux written in Ada, or some 
good (really good) video editing software, maybe then people would recognize 
Ada. Or if Boing puts a sticker on their planes "powered by Ada" ;-)