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From: Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Subject: Re: why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) failed compared to the C family?
Date: Thu, 27 May 2021 09:00:16 -0700	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87wnrkf9pr.fsf@nightsong.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 5afvagd0g4uajs1ji35v3lorkgb2kd56qu@4ax.com

Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> writes:
>>Algol 60 did not have a defined I/O.
> 	<?> Just curious -- do you mean the I/O was all by linked in
> function/subroutines rather than being keywords in the language?

Yeah, something like that.  But there were successful Algol 60
implementations, including on Burroughs and Univac mainframes.
C. A. R. Hoare supposedly called Algol 60 "a language so far ahead of
its time, that it was not only an improvement on its predecessors, but
also on nearly all its successors.

>>I/O in Pascal was flawed.
> 	Well... It probably worked quite well in the original OS...

It wasn't just the I/O:

 http://doc.cat-v.org/bell_labs/why_pascal/

Borland Turbo Pascal was very popular and apparently practical, though.
I never used it but I have the impression that it (like most deployed
Pascal implementations) somehow supplied workarounds to the limitations
described in the paper above.

These were interesting:

* Things Turbo Pascal is Smaller Than:
  https://prog21.dadgum.com/116.html

* Personal History of compilation speed part 2 (scroll down for the
  part about Turbo Pascal):
  https://prog21.dadgum.com/47.html

The binary of Turbo Pascal was eventually released for no cost download,
but apparently the source code was never released.  That is
disappointing based on how cool the above articles make it sound.

  reply	other threads:[~2021-05-27 16:00 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 96+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2014-07-16 12:25 why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) failed compared to the C family? Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-07-16 16:55 ` Luke A. Guest
2014-07-16 17:40 ` john
2014-07-16 17:47   ` Adam Beneschan
2014-07-16 19:57     ` Jeffrey Carter
2014-07-17 11:53       ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, Delphi, Algol, ...) " Luke A. Guest
2014-07-17 17:06         ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) " Jeffrey Carter
2014-07-16 20:52     ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, " Georg Bauhaus
2014-07-16 19:22   ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, Delphi, Algol, ...) " Simon Wright
2014-07-16 19:52   ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) " Jeffrey Carter
2014-07-17  2:14     ` Dan'l Miller
2014-07-17  5:29     ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, anon
2014-07-17 12:24       ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, Dan'l Miller
2014-07-22  0:01         ` Randy Brukardt
2014-07-22  0:59           ` pincerfae
2014-07-22 14:41           ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Dan'l Miller
2014-07-22 21:46             ` Randy Brukardt
2014-07-16 17:41 ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) failed compared to the C family? Adam Beneschan
2014-07-16 23:06   ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, Delphi, Algol, ...) " Simon Clubley
2014-07-16 22:10 ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) " torralbaduran
2014-07-17 11:08 ` Harvey White
2014-07-17 12:04   ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, Delphi, Algol, ...) " Simon Clubley
2014-07-17 12:11     ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) " Simon Clubley
2014-07-17 12:20     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2014-07-18  2:17       ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2014-07-18  6:53         ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, Delphi, Algol, ...) " Simon Wright
2014-07-17 21:37 ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) " leonid.dulman
2014-07-17 22:25   ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-07-17 23:50   ` Shark8
2014-07-18  1:00   ` Lucretia
2014-07-18  8:01   ` J-P. Rosen
2014-07-18 15:35   ` Presentation for the Ada-Europe conference (Was: why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) failed compared to the C family?) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2014-07-19  9:10   ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) failed compared to the C family? Pascal Obry
2014-07-18 11:09 ` leonid.dulman
2014-07-18 18:08 ` isaac1.0
2014-07-18 19:04   ` gautier_niouzes
2014-07-21 23:09     ` isaac1.0
2014-07-19 14:03   ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2014-07-19 12:17 ` jm.tarrasa
2014-07-19 14:12   ` gvdschoot
2014-07-19 14:26     ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, Delphi, Algol, ...) " Simon Clubley
2014-07-19 14:35       ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, Delphi, Algol,...) " gvdschoot
2014-07-19 16:38         ` Simon Clubley
2014-07-19 17:11           ` Georg Bauhaus
2014-07-19 14:56     ` Dan'l Miller
2014-07-19 15:20       ` gvdschoot
2014-07-19 17:56 ` Per Sandberg
2014-07-20 19:40   ` pincerfae
2014-07-20 22:30     ` Shark8
2014-07-20 22:51       ` gautier_niouzes
2014-07-20 23:11         ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2, 2, Oberon, " Shark8
2014-07-20 23:21           ` why the pascal family of languages (Pascal, Ada, Modula-2,2,Oberon, " Dan'l Miller
2014-07-21  1:42             ` Shark8
2014-07-21  4:57               ` Nasser M. Abbasi
2014-07-21  6:51                 ` Shark8
2014-07-21 18:01                   ` pincerfae
2014-07-20 23:18         ` Dan'l Miller
2014-07-21  1:16           ` Shark8
2021-05-27  6:53 ` Robin Vowels
2021-05-27  7:55   ` ldries46
2021-05-27 16:45     ` Robin Vowels
2021-05-28  7:22       ` ldries46
2021-05-28 13:59         ` Robin Vowels
2021-05-27 23:47     ` Wilson
2021-05-27 15:46   ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2021-05-27 16:00     ` Paul Rubin [this message]
2021-05-27 16:49       ` Robin Vowels
2021-05-27 17:53       ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2021-05-28  0:34       ` John Perry
2021-05-28 12:37         ` Shark8
2021-05-28 13:07           ` John Perry
2021-05-28 13:28             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2021-05-30 16:12               ` Luke A. Guest
2021-05-30 19:00                 ` Bill Findlay
2021-05-31 14:26                   ` Paul Rubin
2021-06-01  0:32                     ` Bill Findlay
2021-06-01  3:34                       ` Paul Rubin
2021-06-01 11:23                         ` Bill Findlay
2021-06-01 16:46                           ` Paul Rubin
2021-06-01 23:04                             ` Bill Findlay
2021-06-02 14:04                               ` John Perry
2021-06-02 14:38                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2021-06-02 17:26                                   ` Simon Wright
2021-06-02 18:13                                 ` Bill Findlay
2021-05-28 15:01           ` Gautier write-only address
2021-05-28 14:49       ` Gautier write-only address
2021-05-28 19:22         ` Paul Rubin
2021-06-01 14:09           ` Shark8
2021-06-02 18:51             ` Gautier write-only address
2021-06-07 17:56               ` Shark8
2021-06-02 19:17 ` Gabriele Galeotti
2021-06-02 23:11   ` Randy Brukardt
2021-06-03  1:29     ` Gabriele Galeotti
2021-06-03 16:51       ` Dennis Lee Bieber
2021-06-02 23:40   ` Paul Rubin
2021-06-03  1:04     ` Gabriele Galeotti
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