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From: "Richard  Riehle" <adaworks@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: ADA Popularity Discussion Request
Date: Tue, 07 Sep 2004 02:16:59 GMT
Date: 2004-09-07T02:16:59+00:00	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <vS8%c.69$xA1.4@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net> (raw)
In-Reply-To: e749549b.0409051449.574ec9ce@posting.google.com


"Kevin Cline" <kevin.cline@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:e749549b.0409051449.574ec9ce@posting.google.com...
> Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in message
news:<vpblkhspuA9F@eisner.encompasserve.org>...

> > But assuming perfect testing, finding the errors during compilation
> > rather than in testing saves me time, and time is money.
>
> I thought so too, until I tried incremental test-first development.
> Retesting a unit after adding a few lines of code means that type
> mismatches are caught immediately with or without strong typing.  But
> it goes faster if you don't have to compile and link every iteration.
>
This assumes that we are concerned only with type mismatches.   In
Ada, we expect the compiler to provide a great deal more than that.

For small software systems, frequent testing can often be sufficient. As
the size of the software increases, and complexity of that software grows,
we must engage all the tools available and use them appropriately to
ensure the correctness of our design.   Also, in large software systems,
it is not possible to test every path, every possible value of a variable,
and every potential timing problem.

How does one test for a race condition?   Does that test guarantee
no race condition can occur?    This is not a type checking issue, but
it is a design issue where the type model can be one of many factors
in reasoning about the stability of the design.

How does one test for a runaway pointer or dangling reference?  Again,
this is not strictly a type issue, except that Ada's overall set of rules,
including the type rules, provide some tools for reasoning about this
intelligently.

Finally, testing can only test for what we know needs to be tested.   We
must design for the unexpected, even as we test for the expected.  It is
impossible to test for the unexpected.   The Ada type model includes
both the compile-time checking and the run-time checking.   The rest
of Ada provides a wide range of compile-time checks.

Those who fail to understand this should stay away from building software
that requires a high degree of dependability.

Richard Riehle





  parent reply	other threads:[~2004-09-07  2:16 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 421+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2004-08-11 13:56 ADA Popularity Discussion Request Chris Humphries
2004-08-11 14:14 ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-11 15:39   ` sk
2004-08-11 15:54   ` Marc A. Criley
2004-08-12  4:54     ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-08-13  2:29     ` Brian May
2004-08-13  5:27       ` Ada " Puckdropper
2004-08-21  3:41       ` ADA " Wes Groleau
2004-08-26 21:11       ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-08-27 10:30         ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-31 16:34           ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-08-31 17:48             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-01 16:58               ` Warren W. Gay VE3WWG
2004-09-10 23:12         ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-12 16:50           ` jayessay
2004-08-11 15:45 ` Jerry Petrey
2004-08-11 15:55   ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-11 16:54     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-11 17:14 ` Nick Roberts
2004-08-11 18:00   ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-12 11:48   ` Marin David Condic
2004-08-26  8:07   ` Adrian Hoe
2004-08-26 11:52     ` Marin David Condic
2004-08-27  8:10       ` Adrian Hoe
2004-08-27 14:37         ` Ed Falis
2004-08-27 17:52           ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-27 18:20             ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-27 22:45             ` Wes Groleau
2004-09-03  6:48             ` Adrian Hoe
2004-09-03 12:14               ` stephane richard
2004-09-03 17:33                 ` Björn Persson
2004-08-11 18:58 ` fabio de francesco
2004-08-12  0:05   ` Larry Elmore
2004-08-12 12:29     ` Adam Ruth
2004-08-12 13:25       ` Hardest to read (was: ADA Popularity Discussion Request) Björn Persson
2004-08-12 15:59         ` Frank J. Lhota
2004-08-12 17:31         ` Frank
2004-08-12 20:42         ` Gnat for x86 Solaris David C. Hoos
2004-08-13 19:06           ` Andreas Almroth
2004-08-16 16:19         ` Hardest to read (was: ADA Popularity Discussion Request) Frank J. Lhota
2004-08-13  6:55       ` ADA Popularity Discussion Request Wojtek Narczynski
2004-08-12 22:41 ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-12 23:20   ` Ed Falis
2004-08-13  0:37     ` Nick Roberts
2004-08-13  1:22       ` Ed Falis
2004-08-13  7:01     ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-13  2:55   ` Matt Morgan
2004-08-14  7:26 ` j
     [not found]   ` <fvavh0lmv0644gn5dt45sbj574t3ivqhlt@4ax.com>
2004-08-15 21:26     ` Nick Roberts
2004-08-16  1:02       ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-16 21:09 ` Keith H Duggar
2004-08-16 22:24   ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-08-16 22:30     ` Ed Falis
2004-08-17  6:13     ` Keith H Duggar
2004-08-17 20:13       ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-08-16 22:26   ` Ed Falis
2004-08-17  6:28     ` Keith H Duggar
2004-08-17 13:30       ` Ed Falis
2004-08-17 13:38         ` Martin Dowie
2004-08-18  3:30       ` Dale Stanbrough
2004-08-17  7:50   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
     [not found]     ` <mfb4i09d5kqk8fjdfmrj62kgmooftf1ma8@4ax.com>
2004-08-18  8:58       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-08-26  5:22     ` Dave Thompson
2004-08-26  8:06       ` Dale Stanbrough
2004-08-26 13:37         ` Martin Krischik
2004-08-26  8:14       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-08-26 17:28         ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-17 10:58   ` Marin David Condic
2004-08-17 11:33     ` Martin Dowie
2004-08-17 11:59       ` Marin David Condic
2004-08-17 12:49         ` Martin Dowie
2004-08-17 13:07           ` Marin David Condic
2004-08-19 14:53             ` Martin Dowie
2004-08-17 12:33     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-17 12:54       ` Marin David Condic
2004-08-26  1:27         ` Randy Brukardt
2004-08-26 11:49           ` Marin David Condic
2004-08-17 12:58       ` Martin Dowie
2004-08-17 13:06         ` Martin Dowie
2004-08-17 23:54   ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-18  0:30     ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-18  1:29       ` Björn Persson
2004-08-20 16:39       ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-20 17:41         ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-21 23:23           ` fabio de francesco
2004-08-22  7:16             ` fabio de francesco
2004-08-22  9:44             ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-23  0:18               ` fabio de francesco
2004-08-23  3:44                 ` Wes Groleau
2004-08-26 21:36                   ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27 11:39                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-29 15:08                     ` jayessay
2004-08-30 19:59                       ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-02 14:26                         ` jayessay
2004-08-30 20:21                       ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-23 15:23                 ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-26 21:08                   ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27  5:23                     ` Wes Groleau
2004-08-27 17:29                       ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27 22:50                         ` Wes Groleau
2004-08-27 11:45                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-27 18:22                       ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27 19:14                         ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-28 14:17                           ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-28 18:07                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-29 16:14                               ` jayessay
2004-08-30 17:30                             ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-27 21:42                         ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-29  6:22                         ` Martin Krischik
2004-08-31  7:25                           ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-31  9:37                             ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-08-31 10:54                               ` Martin Dowie
2004-08-31 12:42                               ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-31 13:22                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-31 16:02                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-31 17:29                                 ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-08-31 20:17                                   ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-01  7:08                                     ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-09-01 12:25                                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-01 14:27                                         ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-09-01 20:21                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-02  7:59                                     ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-02 13:33                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-02 14:38                                         ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-09-02 15:33                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-02 16:32                                         ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-02 18:50                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-08-31  9:57                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-08-31 11:51                             ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-02 19:10                             ` Simon Wright
2004-09-12 11:02                               ` Anders Gidenstam
2004-09-12 13:47                                 ` Simon Wright
2004-09-12 15:20                                   ` Anders Gidenstam
2004-09-12 16:36                                     ` Simon Wright
2004-09-12 18:33                                       ` Anders Gidenstam
2004-08-29 15:13                   ` jayessay
2004-08-29 16:34                     ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-23 17:27                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-08-23 18:59                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-24  7:07                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-08-23 22:20                   ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-24  7:07                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-08-26 21:22                 ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-26 20:32             ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27 11:53               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-27 21:48                 ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-28  5:02                   ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-30 19:16                     ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-31 12:16                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-03 15:25                         ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-03 18:51                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-05  3:59                             ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-28 10:20                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-28 10:30                     ` Adrian Knoth
2004-08-28 11:23                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-28 12:28                         ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-08-28 16:45                         ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-29 15:57                           ` jayessay
2004-08-29 16:47                             ` Richard  Riehle
2004-09-03 16:43                               ` jayessay
2004-09-05  4:36                                 ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-05 16:13                                   ` Richard  Riehle
2004-09-05 17:28                                   ` Jean-Marc Bourguet
2004-09-06 16:45                                     ` jayessay
2004-09-06 17:15                                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-07 15:13                                         ` jayessay
2004-09-07 15:57                                           ` jayessay
2004-09-07 15:57                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-07 18:20                                             ` jayessay
2004-09-08 10:40                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-08 19:46                                                 ` jayessay
2004-09-09  1:47                                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-10  1:01                                                     ` jayessay
2004-09-10  9:28                                                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-12 15:59                                                         ` jayessay
2004-09-13 13:19                                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-09  5:38                                                   ` Chad R. Meiners
2004-09-10  1:04                                                     ` jayessay
2004-09-10 21:51                                                       ` Chad R. Meiners
2004-09-06 18:47                                       ` Jean-Marc Bourguet
2004-09-07 15:22                                         ` jayessay
2004-09-07 15:37                                           ` Jean-Marc Bourguet
2004-09-07 17:01                                             ` jayessay
2004-09-07 17:56                                               ` Jean-Marc Bourguet
2004-09-07 18:29                                                 ` jayessay
2004-09-07 19:03                                                   ` Jean-Marc Bourguet
2004-09-07 21:12                                                     ` jayessay
2004-09-08  8:12                                                       ` Jean-Marc Bourguet
2004-09-07 15:58                                           ` jayessay
2004-09-07 22:34                                           ` Björn Persson
2004-09-08 16:28                                             ` jayessay
2004-09-08 23:28                                           ` Randy Brukardt
2004-09-05 21:01                                   ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-09-06  2:17                                     ` stephane richard
2004-09-06 21:12                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-07  8:23                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-07 15:25                                       ` jayessay
2004-09-05 18:28                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
     [not found]                                 ` <e749549b.0409042036.5d4822a2@posting.googlOrganization: LJK Software <vpblkhspuA9F@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2004-09-05 22:49                                   ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-06 16:39                                     ` jayessay
2004-09-07 22:01                                       ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-08  8:52                                         ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-09-08 10:20                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-08 12:01                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-08 16:26                                             ` jayessay
2004-09-08 19:12                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-08 21:02                                                 ` Björn Persson
2004-09-08 23:31                                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-09 16:00                                                     ` Björn Persson
2004-09-08 23:02                                                 ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-09-08 23:23                                                 ` jayessay
2004-09-09  9:12                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-10  1:16                                                     ` jayessay
2004-09-10 15:06                                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-08 21:17                                               ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-10  0:47                                                 ` jayessay
2004-09-10 17:40                                                   ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-12 16:02                                                     ` jayessay
2004-09-10 20:54                                                   ` static typing and test-first development Lionel Draghi
2004-09-08 19:46                                             ` ADA Popularity Discussion Request Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-09-09  7:57                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-10  0:53                                               ` jayessay
2004-09-11 19:52                                                 ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-09-12 16:36                                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-08 16:08                                           ` jayessay
2004-09-08 17:29                                             ` Richard  Riehle
2004-09-08 23:01                                               ` jayessay
2004-09-28  8:14                                                 ` Formal and informal type systems? (Was: ADA Popularity Discussion Request) Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-09-28  9:05                                                   ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-09-28 10:05                                                     ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-09-28 11:02                                                       ` Formal and informal type systems? Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-28 11:31                                                         ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-09-28 17:49                                                           ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-28 18:06                                                           ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-09-29  0:56                                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-29  9:10                                                             ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-09-28 18:54                                                         ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-09-28 18:57                                                           ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-09-28 20:19                                                           ` jayessay
2004-09-28 20:34                                                             ` Wojtek Narczynski
2004-09-28 21:03                                                               ` jayessay
2004-09-29 10:23                                                                 ` Wojtek Narczynski
2004-09-29 15:32                                                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-28 23:47                                                           ` Stephen Leake
2004-09-29  1:23                                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-29  9:11                                                             ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-09-29 10:30                                                             ` Wojtek Narczynski
2004-09-29  7:49                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-29 17:53                                                             ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-09-30  8:25                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-29 10:37                                                           ` Wojtek Narczynski
2004-09-28 20:20                                                       ` Formal and informal type systems? (Was: ADA Popularity Discussion Request) Wojtek Narczynski
2004-09-28 20:03                                                   ` Wojtek Narczynski
2004-09-09  1:08                                         ` ADA Popularity Discussion Request Kevin Cline
2004-09-09  1:35                                           ` Ed Falis
2004-09-09 20:11                                             ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-11  0:04                                               ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-11  1:10                                                 ` Ed Falis
2004-09-12 16:20                                               ` jayessay
2004-09-12 23:25                                                 ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-13 10:13                                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-13 21:29                                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-14  9:15                                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-15  2:15                                                 ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-09-09  3:01                                           ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-10 23:56                                             ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-11  9:50                                               ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-11 18:09                                                 ` Benjamin Ketcham
2004-09-11 18:33                                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-12  6:00                                                     ` Benjamin Ketcham
2004-09-12 17:45                                                       ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-12 17:41                                                     ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-13  0:30                                                       ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-13  6:06                                                       ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-12  0:51                                                   ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-09-12  6:05                                                     ` Benjamin Ketcham
2004-09-12  7:52                                                     ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-12 17:17                                                     ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-09-12 13:02                                                   ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-09-12 19:05                                                     ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
     [not found]                                                   ` <zi1oZiVz9I4A@eisner.encoOrganization: LJK Software <UHjU2NulgeUs@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2004-09-12 21:21                                                     ` Marin David Condic
2004-09-13  7:42                                                       ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-15 20:45                                                         ` Marin David Condic
2004-09-16  8:03                                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-16 18:45                                                             ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-17  7:29                                                               ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-13  0:48                                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-09-13 14:25                                                   ` Marius Amado Alves
2004-09-13  5:56                                                 ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-13 11:49                                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-13 13:30                                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-14 17:14                                                     ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-14 17:29                                                     ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-13 14:58                                                 ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-09-13 16:01                                                   ` Marius Amado Alves
     [not found]                                                 ` <mailman.16.1095009448.390.comp.lang.ada@ada-france.Organization: LJK Software <7+giGppWCdX3@eisner.encompasserve.org>
2004-09-14 20:17                                                   ` David Gay
2004-09-11  9:59                                               ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-12  5:32                                                 ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-12  7:19                                                   ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-13  0:43                                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-13 16:40                                                       ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-13 21:19                                                         ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-13 21:36                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-14 17:27                                                           ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-12  7:50                                                   ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-12 23:59                                                     ` Brian May
2004-09-13  0:45                                                     ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-13  6:19                                                       ` Dale Stanbrough
2004-09-13  7:50                                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-13 13:35                                                           ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-13 15:39                                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-13 15:51                                                               ` Hyman Rosen
2004-09-14  8:32                                                                 ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-14  9:07                                                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-14 14:04                                                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-14 15:57                                                                       ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-15  8:29                                                                         ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-15  9:30                                                                           ` Martin Dowie
2004-09-15 10:05                                                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-15 10:14                                                                           ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-15 12:50                                                                             ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-16  4:29                                                                     ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-16  7:38                                                                       ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-16 18:45                                                                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-17  5:58                                                                           ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-18 16:44                                                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-19 11:22                                                                               ` Simon Wright
2004-09-19 12:22                                                                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-19 18:04                                                                                   ` Simon Wright
2004-09-20  7:36                                                                                 ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-20 20:41                                                                             ` Randy Brukardt
2004-09-21  8:11                                                                               ` Martin Krischik
2004-09-22 20:51                                                                                 ` Simon Wright
2004-09-16  8:01                                                                       ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-09-14 20:35                                                                   ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-15  8:29                                                                     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-16 18:43                                                                       ` Pascal Obry
2004-09-14 16:28                                                 ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-11 11:44                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-14 16:50                                                 ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-14 17:32                                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-09 19:58                                           ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-11  0:07                                             ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-11 12:06                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-12 16:33                                                 ` jayessay
2004-09-13 12:43                                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-13  6:58                                                 ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-13 13:06                                                   ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-12 16:30                                               ` jayessay
2004-09-12 22:55                                                 ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-12 23:08                                                 ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-13  2:37                                                   ` John B. Matthews
2004-09-13 21:28                                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-13 13:08                                                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-09  0:13                                       ` Randy Brukardt
2004-09-09  1:07                                         ` Testing v compile time checks for errors Jeffrey Carter
2004-09-11  0:23                                         ` ADA Popularity Discussion Request Kevin Cline
2004-09-14  0:17                                           ` Randy Brukardt
2004-09-12 16:22                                         ` jayessay
2004-09-14  0:49                                           ` Randy Brukardt
2004-09-14 14:28                                             ` jayessay
2004-09-06 21:01                                     ` Stephen Leake
2004-09-13  6:23                                       ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-07  2:16                                     ` Richard  Riehle [this message]
2004-09-07  3:57                                       ` Benjamin Ketcham
2004-09-07 16:42                                         ` Richard  Riehle
2004-09-07 20:51                                           ` jayessay
2004-09-07 22:21                                             ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-09-08  5:26                                               ` Richard  Riehle
2004-09-08  6:56                                                 ` Mark Lorenzen
2004-09-08 15:56                                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-08 15:36                                               ` jayessay
2004-09-08 15:37                                                 ` Jean-Marc Bourguet
2004-09-08 10:29                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-08 16:04                                               ` jayessay
2004-09-09  2:52                                           ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-07  7:46                                       ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-09-14 20:14                                       ` Kevin Cline
2004-09-20 21:45                                         ` Lurker
2004-09-07 22:37                                     ` Lionel Draghi
2004-09-06  7:49                                 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-09-06 16:36                                   ` jayessay
2004-09-06 17:32                                     ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-07 13:48                                       ` jayessay
2004-09-07 15:13                                         ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-07 15:54                                           ` jayessay
2004-09-08 12:33                                             ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-08 13:17                                               ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-09-09  1:02                                         ` Randy Brukardt
2004-09-09  9:15                                           ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-09-07 22:18                                     ` Lionel Draghi
2004-08-28 14:45                     ` User Name
2004-08-28 20:02                     ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-08-30 12:20                   ` Jano
2004-08-20 19:50         ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-08-26 20:42           ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27  1:22             ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-08-27 15:22               ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27 16:26                 ` Georg Bauhaus
2004-08-30 19:08                   ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-27 18:08                 ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-08-28 14:05                   ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-26 21:52           ` Kevin Cline
2004-08-20 17:53       ` Alexander E. Kopilovich
2004-08-21  1:34         ` Richard  Riehle
2004-08-18  0:37     ` Jeffrey Carter
2004-08-18  1:53     ` Steve
2004-08-18  8:58     ` Dmitry A. Kazakov
2004-08-18 10:04       ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-08-18 17:55         ` Ludovic Brenta
2004-08-18 17:58           ` Ed Falis
2004-08-19  7:41           ` Jean-Pierre Rosen
2004-08-19 14:36             ` Larry Kilgallen
2004-08-30 14:00               ` Jacob Sparre Andersen
2004-08-30 15:27                 ` Martin Krischik
2004-08-25 18:26         ` John Kern
2004-08-18 10:32       ` Björn Persson
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2004-08-26  2:08 Robert C. Leif
2004-08-31 17:58 Lionel.DRAGHI
2004-09-01  7:21 ` Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen
2004-09-01 12:18 Lionel.DRAGHI
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